New glass for my Christmas present

I ordered a new rifle last week from AOA, a FX Royale 400.

For years I have advised people that if they can afford it, to spend a equal mount on their scopes as they spend on their rifles if they want to get full potential out of their guns.

But most of us get caught up with this "its only a airgun" attitude and buy Chinese junk that should be regulated to airsoft guns. I rcently had a Hawke Sidewinder 6x24x56 that I would put in that catagory. What good is a 24 power scope when it is only clear to 18 power?

I used to use Leupolds on all of my many elk rifles, and have owned everything from Mark 4's, on a SR 25 to a very early 4 power a friend bought at a garage sale with a broken croshair, he sent it back to Leupold and they fixed it for free.



I think the best long range combination I have owned was a Remington Sendero in 300 Ultramag with a Leupold VXIII 3x19x50 with a computer printout taped to the stock. One day below my house I shot a coyote 2 out of 3 shots at 732 yards, ranging him with a Swarovski RF-1.

Recently I upgraded my Ranger 45's scope from a Burris 2x7 Fullfield to a VXII 3 with LR duplex. What a difference that made even tho the 2x7 Burris Fullfield is a nice scope in its own right.

So after ordering the Royale 400, I was cruising thru Ebay looking at used scopes, and I saw a Leupold VXIII Long Range 30 MM SF 4.5X14 with the Hollands custom reticle. Hollands here in Oregon designed that reticle to give 30 aiming spots in 30 MOA. Each cross hatch also has 4 minutes of windage marks. The scope itself has 116 inches of adjustment at 100 yards. The reticle can be seen at WWW.Hollandguns.com.

Oddly enough checking Hollands site reminded me that I had met him in a dark foggy canyon bottom behind my house one elk season many years ago, small world.

I only had 18 minutes to decide to bid, that was all there was left on the auction, so I had to do 'Due Diligence' fast to check everything out. I checked Hollands site, Leupolds site and the buyers site, he makes long rangle hunting rifles in Utah. Knowing some Leupolds are counterfitted now, I checked that and found it is only the M 4's and Prismatics that the Chinese are copying and how to spot them.

Holland list the scope on his site at $1250.00. The wife and I sat side by side waiting for 45 seconds left on the auction so we could not be out bid before we pulled the trigger, or in this case pushed the make a big button. I ended up getting it at less that half the price that Holland lists it.

So hopefully in another week or so I will have a very nice piece of glass to put on that new Royale.

Regards,

Roachcreek

USPS tracking tells me my scope has arrived at the Post Office. I don't get the Royale 400 and Rings until tomorrow, so it will wait there for my weekly trip to town.

Now how is that for restraint?

Regards,

Roachcreek

Man, I GOTTA learn how to use those marks in the scope! Mind if I Q&A you on it? Maybe start a new thread on it?

Looks wicked, though.

Nice pics!

Squirrel,

Turned out that it was not the Hollands 30 MOA reticle, it is the Hollands 21 MOA. THe seller was selling it for a customer and got it wrong.

However the 21 MOA fit my needs better due to the scope being a 2ndFF scope.

I have t use the max power to get the true MOA. I mounted it and shot it at 14 power to get a zero at 50 with the 18.1 grain Exact Heavies and then moved the target to 80 yards which is a commonly used birding distance for me. I fired a 5 shot group, well under an inch and then looked to see on the reticle where the group landed.

It landed on the 6 MOA dot, so now I have the 80 yard holdover. Next I went to 100 yards and repeated the procedure and found that the slash for 13.5 MOA was the one I needed. So again I have the 50, 80 and 100 yard holdover references.

The scale above the reticle intersection is in MIlls for Range finding, as are the scales on the horixontal line. I use a Rangefinder so I don't need to do the math.

So far I am really liking this combo.

Regards,

Roachcreek

Aye, I missed this one somehow . . .

I'd like to get my grubby paws on a good range finder one day. Wouldn't have to be a bank breaker but not a penny saver. I want what I want. Buyer's remorse would set in otherwise.

Man, Roach, seems like you got that down to a science!

I wished one day, just one, I could get out and work with you as you did some of this stuff. Man, what I could learn!

Sorry I missed your post. It was a good one too!

Apologies.

I knew that at 140 yards, basically all the distance I can get comfortably right now at the vineyard, I would run out of reticle with a 50 yard zero. So I dialed in the 100 yard POI which is 12 MOA.

The rifle is shooting 34 FPE with 18.1 Exacts at 920 FPS, I was shooting off the hood of my Explorer with a Caldwell bag and using a rolled up jacket under the butt. The windflags were wet with the morning dew and hanging straight down.

The target was three pieces of taped end to end bond paper. The pellets dropped 23.5 inches from the 100 yad zero and landed on the 16.5 MOA mark on theHolland retilce in a 5 shot 2 inch group.

I'm going to have to edit the picture sizes in this.

I thought I'd taken care of this. This must be some really big pictures.

I'll take a look at it and see what I need to do to keep the "cut off" from happening again.

But I've got a full plate right now and will havet to table it and my reply for now---but I'll get to it. I do want to respond as well as get your pictures to full size without loosing any of the frame . . .

Be back later on today!

Until I can figure a sure fire way to make sure that no one has to keep resizing pictures I'm going to share this with you.


To make the picture look that small, I wrote this:

Code:

[center]
<img src="http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af343/chbartlemay/FX  Royale/DSC06576.jpg" style="height:200px; width:200px;" alt="image" />
[/center][

Please don't miss that there is a scroll bar at the bottom of the box showing the code: Something else I'll have to see if I can fix or if it is a limitaton of the site software. Anyway . . .

Now, if I want it to appear larger as below:


Then I change the last part of the sentence as so:

Code:

[center]
<img src="http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af343/chbartlemay/FX  Royale/DSC06576.jpg" style="height:300px; width:300px;" alt="image" />
[/center]

Notice in the above whereas height:300px; width:300;" was changed from 200 to 300.

Now, if I want it even bigger I'll change that to 400 by 400. See below:


Notice the code for this and where the numbers change:

Code:

[center]
<img src="http://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af343/chbartlemay/FX  Royale/DSC06576.jpg" style="height:200px; width:200px;" alt="image" />
[/center]

This sucks to have to do. But if you will copy that snip it and input your link in the place for your image as in this case . . . "https://i1022.photobucket.com/albums/af343/chbartlemay/FX Royale/DSC06576.jpg Royale/DSC06576.jpg", you'll always have control over what you post and what size it is.

I haven't given up on making it easier for people to post pictures. But until I can find a way to not to have to use some code to do it, this is the best I can do. In your case, when I get more time, I'll go back and edit your posts so that your pictures come out right. I don't think it right that anyone have to do this but it is the best I can do for now. Stay with me and give me a little time to see what I can figure out.

Until then, I apologize for the inconvenience whole heartedly.

In your case I'll go back and personally edit the pictures to make sure it works and looks right. I guess that's part of my job here and I don't mind at all.

But do give me a little while to get it done. I've got a lot on my plate right now.

-Admin

Don't get me wrong though, I like the scope stuff (I got a smelting pot for making my own bullets for Xmas) and all that but I want to hear about the Royale.

I've got my eye on the .25 caliber. Any reason why you didn't go for the .25 and got the .22 instead?

And while I agree with you on getting what you pay for in a scope, I'll have to save up for a year, if not longer, to get that .25 I'm looking at gettting one day.

Do you know of any scopes that have such clear and well etched glass that could start me off with my intended .25 Royale 500? I'm interested and may want to keep my eyes out for that deal that never comes when you are ready to get it. Know what I mean?

Anyway, too, I got your pictures fixed. I could tweek them a little more if you like but I think that they are fine the way I left them.

Get back on the scope and .25 vs the .22 if and when you can . . .

Later Roach!

Thanks for fixing the pictures everybody.

Your about to start another addiction, next will come molds and sizers, that is two addictive behaviors, becareful you will find yourself on that tv show Intervention. .

I gave the 25 vrs 22 a lot of thought, in the end I had a 130 FPE 25 a 50 FPE 25, both custom AF rifles, and I could not safely shoot starlings out of the tops of Doug Firs with 25's, those pellets have to come down somewhere. Although I do use Chairgun and Google earth and know where my pellets are landing, a 22 makes it a lot easier.

The length and weight of the Royale 500 as an issue also.

Having said all that, my next rifle will most likiely be a Royale 500 or the Evanix speed.

But in the long run, I can always sell the 22 Royale and try the 25, Royales and Leupolds are almost to the status of legal tender.

Scopes, I rub a lot of people the wrong way on scopes in that I say do what ever you can to get good glass, especially on a fine gun like a Royale. You will never take advatage of the potential without good glass.

On the low end I would look at the $300.00 level, something like a 3200 Bushbnell or a Leupold 3x9 both with adjustable objectives. I have a new 3x9x40 Leupold with the LR duplex on my Ranger 45 and I have a Bushnell 3200 5x15 Tactical on one of my Condors, they are both great scopes, with superior optics, good reticles and are just quality glass.

I personally steer away from 30mm tubes side focus and lighted reticles when I am trying for a budget scope, the reason is good lenses are more important to me than the mentioned luxeries. Think about it , if your trying to meet a price point of $300.00 and one quality scope has only a Mildot and target turrents, and another has both of those, and is 30mm and has a lighted reticle and a side focus, which manufacturer spent the most on their lenses? My 3200 Tactical 5x15 vrs the Millet TR-1 is a fine example of this issue. THe 3200 is just great glass without all the add ons.

I have also found the side focus scopes difficult to focus for me. I have had a Hawke Sidewinder 6x24x56, a Millet TR 1 4x16, and theLeupold in this post, none of them focus as well as the 3200 with a AO.

I have purchased some cheap scopes when I first got into air gunning under the theory that it is only an airgun and bought Barasks's, They did not break down on me, but lacked a very important quality I need in my work, because of poor lense quality, I could not see the pellet flight as it streaks towards starlings in the tops of trees, therefore I could not see how the wind at the tops of the trees affected the pellets flight for a 2nd shot. I do see that with the Busnbell 3200 and I see it with the Lepole VXIII, I did not see it with the Baraskas or the Millet.

Most scopes will be clear, coating of lenses to some acceptable degree is common in even the cheap scopes, but when put on high magnification, the clarity goes to hell. Cheaper scopes suffer from thick reticles at times and do not track well.

If I were you I would look at scopes that sold for $300.00 and try to pick them up used, get a 1 inch tube, forget about lighted reticles. I would stay with good established brand names like Leupold, Busnell, Burris and Nikon or the SWFA SS Sniper series.

Bottom line, a great rifle can never be as great as it can be with a $100.00 scope.

Hope this helps without ruffling feathers.

Regards,

Roachcreek

Very good post. I like it. Good humor (real good humor) and great information.

Me? No feathers of experience nor opinion to ruffle but there is one difference we have: Side focus.

For me, side focus is a must. I am blind in one eye and, of course, no depth perception. I'm pretty good, for a guy with only one eye, on judging distance but these are tricks I've learned to apply in the last 13 years of my life that I've been restricted to monocular vision. There will be no way I can tell anyone what this is like unless they are willing to spend a couple of days, or a week I'd prefer, going around saying "Ho, ho, and a bottle of rum!" and "Shiver me timbers!" taking the flack you'd get from friends wanting to know why you'd wear a patch---and laughing at your willingness to go the extra mile in trying to understand life with only one good eye.

But, basically, I tried the end tube focus for AO and I can't ever seem to do the "off hand" and "on the fly" shot without a LOT of adjustment. I've actually seen squirrels rolling in laughter, one falling from his branch as he couldn't contain his laughter and balance simultaneously at me while I had to make camp complete with a small fire while I frantically tried to get the yardage down to a close enough for government call and then turn the end of the tube to match so as to get even a fuzzy look see through the magic thing that lets me see the squirrels in collusion with enough clarity to actually take a shot that have declared war against my castle. And by then the joke is over for them and they've moved on to start another tirade of laughter from their next perch.

Enter side focus:

The side focus, I've found, with a 60 to 80mm (100 being to big for my taste) and my style of stance finds my thumb now, with a lot of practice, at the wheel with my left hand (I'm a righty) focusing a bead on my target and, sometimes, even firing off a shot before I can get my entire left hand to the proper placement on the forestock. One thing good about Air Guns: Not much of a kick and although sometimes much heavier, a quick bead and shot fired means no arm fatigue or the shanking associated with it. All this meaning the squirrels joyally laughing get a real knockdown surprise.

I always check the numbers on the wheel to see what they reveal in yardage as well and this constant observance keeps me sharp-er about my tricks of distance judgment.

But as for the rest of it, I couldn't be in more agreement. However, I think Google Earth, and not Google Maps, would be better for falling rounds fired from a Royale as they are, it would seem, and extraordinary air gun. . . But the likely-hood of having to get or figure shot placement using Gun Chair Pro (that I also use) of one that missed is highly unlikely as it would have to be operator error and, I'm perfect, don't you know: I don't miss and I NEVER have operator error.

Just saying.

Isn't EVERYone like that?

Well, I guess the wind COULD mess me up or some other force of nature . . . or maybe an act of God such as a hurricane, tornado . . . or earth quake? We are prone to all those here in the most polite city in the USA.

Regardless, the weight is a grave concern with me on an AG. I have a Sumatra 2500 500cc .25 caliber and that thing is a TREE LIMB to carry around let alone fire off a round at something you may have to hold a bead a minute or two before pulling the trigger. And then the follow up shots can be shorter and shorter in stance as I've already worn out my little twigs for arms.

I see you got the composite stock. (um, you did, didn't you?) I wonder how much weight that takes off? I see too that there is about a $200 difference in the walnut vs. composite pricing. And, while the collector in me wants a great deal more than what is practical, I do already have several .22s my Rainstorm being my favorite grab and go for small game, my Infinity my favorite do all kill all and maybe hog dropper (one day, I can only hope and pray--or is that "prey"? )

But, I must ask, do you have a DB meter? And do you have a DB measurement, or even estimation, about what level your .22 400 would be? My .25 Sumatra is a good .25, I think, although he and I are still in the process of making friends and he informing me on what he likes to eat best way of that magic pellet, but the darn thing is LOUD without an appliance stuck off the end of it getting me attention and questions I'd rather not have.

But one thing that tree branch noise buster does have my friend is staying power. You can shoot that thing ALL day long and twice on Sunday if not a few more times.

And what FPS/FPE (barrel and POI) can you get with it shooting what grain and pellet out of your .22? You are shooting some insane distances---gotta be fairly light to get out that far and still have some decent trajectory. Or am I wrong on that front?

Nevertheless, and wrapping this up, yea, I already got 3 molds. Matter of fact, I got them first. I haven't broken out the melter yet. It's still in the box. I've still got to get handles, a ladle, etc to make it a complete kit to start my first cast. I've never done this particular addiction before so I'll have to take it slowly and with care. Hot lead and fumes are nothing with which to play and this I know. I didn't get to be more than half a century old without some care in the things I do, eh?

Yours Truly;
-Squirrel (member name)
-AKA: Abda (Admin name)

. . .and we both say your welcome. Anytime for the pictures. If you ever get into a bind with it, and until I can figure out the deal with big pictures and them getting cut off, just send me an email if I don't catch it and I'll straighten it out for you. That goes for anyone else out there having issues with pictures.

One eyed? Yeah I know all those jokes.

I retired because I was hit in the head with a 70 lb bench at the age of 30 during a race riot. Good news is I got a very good pension for life, could follow what ever endeavor I wished for as long as I wanted, hense the mountain man stuff and world traveling, bad news is I get horrible migraines that make me go blind, paralyze part of my body and at the age of 48 permantently blinded me in my left eye.

I don't wear the patch, I was too vain or not so smart, so at the end of the day my brain is tired from removing the garabage that the patch would have prevented me from seeing. I thought about having the left eye removed, but I decided t keep it for spare parts and besides it was too pretty and the girls liked it.

So my friend we have a bit in common.

I got the plastic stock because I bought the gun used, no difference in weight, but I do love nice wood, problem is with that depth perception problem and the fact I do fall and walk like a drunk when tired, wood gets scarred up.

I am still playing with velocity and trajectory and using primarily the 18 grain Exact, today if there is no wind I will try it at 31 FPE, it is insanely accurate, like .20 inches at 36 yards for 10 and 12 shot groups accurate, how that computes at the longer distances I will see if the wind is absent, if it is windy I will cut firewood from the fallen trees from the winter storms.

I have considered getting a 25 caliber 2500 Sumatra and opening the barrel lead to feed my 57 grain 25 bullets, the way they are now they do not chamber in Sumatras or any LW barrel without the lead work. I think that would be perhaps one of the best powerhouse 25's out there. I look every day for one on the yellow, but right now they seem scarce, or too expensive.

I don't carry a tree limb while hunting, I have considered carrying a car door while hunting, they are easy to shoot from out the window and I could always roll the window down if I got too hot while hunting.

My Leupold VXIII has the side focus, but it is not marked, I suppose I need to talk to the custom shop on that one, I need to get target turrents also, so perhaps they can make focusing easier for me.

Regards,

Roachcreek

Well, how now, brown cow, I guess we *do* have a thing or two in common. But my eye (what's left of it) isn't a pretty sight (pun, pun). It's shrunken and not something to look at. Kills me the Moms at the checkout lines trying to grab young junior's hand pointing at my face saying, "Mooommmmaaaa" What's wrong with his eye?" in that lilt and tilt that only children can use and sound truly serious when asking a question.

They've warned me that I'll have to have it removed as it grows smaller and harder and the migraines get worse because of it. But I'm not so willing to jump in that situation as they've told me that it will HURT for a few days. Squirrel don't like hurt: Uh, uh. I'll let it go fir a time more I reckon.

But wearing a patch I think, is something I should do just to protect my friends and adults I talk to when I'm out and about. They try, oh so hard, to not look but they do anyway and the inner battle that they fight in doing so makes me feel sorry for them not knowing quite how to deal with my dead and shrunken fish eye that is oh so obvious.

But, at any rate, tell you what, if you are interested, I've got a Sumatra .25 I'm willing to let go. I'll lake the funds I get from it, as long as it goes to a good home, and stack that up for when I *do* get a Royale. I've got an appliance for it as well---backyard friendly with it on.

Like the window idea. Maybe put one on my wheelchair and declare vehicle rights, eh?

But on the side focus, you can purchase, and this I know you are aware, the add on wheel and it is most always marked. I've got a sidewinder myself but I don't like the wheel on it as it seems to be too stiff: haven't had it out in the field in cold weather but I can just imagine it being something requiring a monkey wrench to operate.

Lemme know on the Sumatra. Email me or whatever, or here, makes no difference to me. Pictures available upon request. I don't know what to ask for it just what it cost me. But I know enough to know I probable will have to take some kind of a loss on it. I've not really shot it enough to break it in good. It's THAT new.

Get back to me when yo can on it.

Squirrel,



I sent you an email, but I suspect I just sent it to myself, or at least I got a copy of it.

I have to heal up from dropping 2 K on the christmas present.

Perhaps later.

Regards,

Roachcreek

My email has been funny, or, rather, not so, here of late.

Regardless, I've got it. I'll let you have first crack at it when and if . . .

Whenever is fine with me.

Yea, on the pocket needing sewing up to stop the hemorrhaging. I can identify without a doubt.

I've got my aim on about 5 grand of AG addiction this year baring lawyers for probate, doctors and what have you.

. . . I'm really cracking myself up: Thinking about what I just said that song by Warren Zevon comes to mind that goes like this:



Yep, Dad, send lawyer's guns and money!

I miss him, I do. He'd of gotten a kick out of that considering why I need the lawyers and money if not the guns!

i thought i was the only one left alive who liked warren zevon. now i don't feel so all alone.

Roach LIVES!

Hey, Brother . . .

Yea, I'm an old rocker. I think they now call it "rewind" or "classic vinyl".

But sort of fits, eh? LOL (the song)

Yesterday or so I turned on the tube and saw that Whitney had passed. Oh, my . . . struck me the same as when Elvis passed (I was in basic training during THAT time) and later when Lucille passed (cried on that one).

My arm feels like it is about to come out of socket but I thought this one a post I just had to reply.

So, whatcha up to these days, Roach? Currently I have a new project even though I haven't finished the Shoe Box and other projects I have going that I've tabled. A friend and I, actually, he'll be doing all the work, will be putting two different AGs together to come out with what will be, eventually, a .25 caliber Rainstorm.

But first I gotta sell off my Sumatra .25 2500 500cc AG. I've got lots of extras for it and thinking about letting the scope on it go with it for the extra cash needed. I just can't seem to type long enough to get the ad posted in all the places I'd need to to get it tendered as needed.

Speaking of which, my arm has called it quits again . . . I hate getting old!

I made myself a metal clad target that will give me two audio replies depending on the location of the hit.

The target is a piece of 3x4' 1/2 inch plywood, laminated with metal sheeting and suspended1.5 inches in front of it is a 12 inch disk. A shot to the disk gives a tink and a shot to the black metalgives a thwack.



Below is a group I shot yesterday at 150 yards with 18.1 JSB's at 941 FPS



I have put shims under the rear ring so that I can take advantage of the 106 minutes of adjustment I have, I can also zero it in for 260 yards and shoot from the railing of the deck at the house.